World Tour Finals Groups Finalized: Federer and Nadal in Same Group

Group A

Djokovic
Murray
Ferrer
Berdych

Group B

Nadal
Federer
Tsonga
Fish

So it’s official. The draw has been done and I am pretty happy with what I see. It is almost a surprise to see Roger and Nadal in the same group, given that they never get drawn in the same half in the slams. This is also the first time in the Masters Cup that they will be in the same group. So I am very happy with that. They could even end up meeting twice if they both make it to the final. The rest of Roger’s group looks OK. Tsonga is always a dangerous player but Roger has now won their last two meetings and will feel confident that he can do so again. Fish will probably end up being the whipping boy of group B. The groups are well balanced because Tsonga and Berdych is more or less on the same level, while the same goes for Ferrer and Fish. Ferrer will probably end up being the whipping boy of group A again like he was last year.

I also like the fact that Tsonga and Nadal is in the same group. I think Tsonga has a better chance of beating Nadal than Berdych has. So I think in group B Roger will go through and then it will be between Nadal and Tsonga for the remaining spot. It would be nice if Nadal doesn’t make semis. But if he makes it through that is also OK. It would be cool if he loses to Djokovic again, or play Roger in the final again. In group A I think Djokovic will go through, and then it is between Murray and Berdych for the remaining spot. Berdych could beat Murray again like he did in Paris, in which case he will probably go through. It is tough to tell what will happen though. For instance Murray could beat Djokovic and lose to Berdych, while Berdych could lose to Djokovic but beat Murray, in which case you could have three guys with the same amount of wins. Same could happen in group B.

But certainly for me group B is by far the most interesting. Not only because I’m a Fedfan, but because an indoor Fedal match is something to look forward too. And then you have Nadal against Tsonga which will be interesting too. Group A is more the group of the pushers, so the matches will be less interesting. The only match that could be interesting there is Murray against Djokovic, and to a lesser extent Murray against Berdych. As far as the order of play goes we will have a repeat of the Paris final first up on Sunday when Roger opens proceedings against Tsonga.

OOPhttp://www.atpworldtour.com/Scores/Schedule.aspx

Here is something to wet your appetites so long:

Roger Federer


Posted in Uncategorized.

34 Comments

  1. Fed needs to sustain a high level of play and concentration to defeat Rafa once, let alone twice. the surface will be a slight advantage but no more than that. hope he can pull it of and come out on top like last year.

    [Reply]

    booya719 Reply:

    I think the surface is more than just a slight advantage. On this surface Federer’s backhand has been able to stand up against Nadal. Nadal employs the same strategy against Federer everywhere – moonball his backhand to no end, but Federer can actually hit backhand winners on a fast court against Nadal that Nadal otherwise chases down and pushes back with ease on the slow courts.
    Of course Nadal is Nadal and he is hard to beat anywhere, but we can be glad that it’s a change from clay where it’s insanely difficult for Federer to beat him. On this surface we can look forward to the match-up and be glad that Federer can hit winners here.

    [Reply]

  2. my poor Rafa. drawn against the GOAT and Tsonga. hope he atleast beats Fish. ENJOY ya all Fedfans. enjoy Fed demolish our Rafa. hope Tsonga beats Federer though, dnt count the paris final, he was spent after the epic semi with Isner. Counting on you Tsonga to do it for Rafa!

    [Reply]

    Susan Reply:

    Hi Emy, im confused as to why you are on a FedFan site. Why aren’t you on Rafas site. Why do so many Rafa and Nole fans spend so much time trying to put Federer down. Is it because your favorite players fall short and you are unsatisfied? I could understand that because they will never, ever compare to Roger.

    [Reply]

    emy Reply:

    Hi Susan.
    im here cos i like Roger too. maybe im a bit biased where Rafa is concerned, but i genuinely like Roger. I root for him everytime he plays against any other player but Rafa. and Susan, lighten up! i said everything in jest. would a Rafa worshiper call Roger the GOAT? dnt thnk so.

    [Reply]

    Jiten Reply:

    Dear Emy,
    You are contradicting your own statements. On one hand you are saying that “I root for him everytime he plays against any other player but Rafa.”, but on the other you are commenting that “hope Tsonga beats Federer though”. Don’t be such a hypocrite on a FedFan’s site.

    [Reply]

    Ru-an Reply:

    Don’t tell my readers to lighten up when you contradict yourself. You are very close to a ban now.

    [Reply]

    emy Reply:

    same difference it will make. i have already said my good byes.

    [Reply]

    Susan Reply:

    emy, i am trying to think of different things to say but all i can come uo with is i’m sorry if your feelings were hurt. I read Ruans Federer Blog for many reasons. Ruans knowledge and analysis of play are what drew me at first but i find the common bond of being a Federer Fan is hugely important.Together we ache when he plays poorly and loses and then we rejoice when he plays his genius game. Our passion for him is deep and true.Please understand that this site is not the place to tell people you want any player to beat Roger. Be well.

    [Reply]

    Ru-an Reply:

    Why do you post the same comment you post in the last post?

    [Reply]

    emy Reply:

    hi Ruan!!
    great job you doing here!

    [Reply]

  3. Thanks Ruan, im happy with Rogers draw also. I have a concern that Rafa hasn’t played and may feel more rested then Roger. Not sure how well Djkovic will do if that shoulder hasn’t healed, he may not be able to finish which is fine with me because i just dont like him. Hope Roger is getting some good rest and he enters the court with his win attitude. Can’t wait to watch our champ play. Loving all this Roger in November.

    [Reply]

  4. Just checked the new rankings…. Can someone explain to me why Roger lost some 500 pts. to fall further behind Murray after just winning a masters tournament for the first time in Paris?

    [Reply]

    Jack Reply:

    The rankings are fairly confusing, so your confusion is understandable. The points from last year’s WTF have been taken off of the rankings, so Roger lost 1500 points from his flawless victory last year, Murray made the semis, so he has less points to lose.

    This is what forum members on rogerfederer.com seem to say is the reason why Roger isn’t No.3 at the moment. I’m no expert, I’m just going on what was said there :-P

    ALLEZ ROGER!

    [Reply]

  5. Indeed the groups are balanced and it’s going to be a very interesting tournament.
    I wish Federer could keep up the high level from recent weeks but I have to say that I will be surprised if he has a smooth trip to the finals like last year. However, he should win at least two matches in the RR stage.
    I also wish he would meet Nadal in the opening round but I guess they’ll meet only in the last round (probably to decide the group winner) because of TV ratings demand. At least he got Tsonga in the 1st round, with the Paris loss fresh in his mind and hopefully a bit unconfident (I wouldn’t want Federer to meet Tsonga after Tsonga beats Nadal).

    [Reply]

  6. I know Roger beat Nadull in all their encounters in this tourney but it would be disgusting for me to see Nadull wins another big title from the hands of Roger.Please God don´t let it happen.If he wants to win let him do it by beatig Djoko.
    I really wish Roger would want to win this Final…

    [Reply]

    emy Reply:

    i jst said a little prayer for Rafa too!

    [Reply]

    Veronica Lee Reply:

    Emy, it must be miserably lonely to be a Rafa fan; no fan to understand you, no Rafa blogs for you to comment, no? Fed fans and Fed blogs are always warmer; that’s why you are here, no? Better let Rafa blogs know that you are saying a little prayer for Rafa coz Rafa would really need a prayer, no?

    [Reply]

    Manu Reply:

    Emy ain’t no Rafa Fan- the poster’s just a Fed Hater. It’s that simple.

    [Reply]

  7. Good post.

    To my mind the key is Djokovic’s fitness. If he’s at full strength, he’ll probably go undefeated in his group, and we have a good chance of a Federer-Djokovic final. We may see a reverse of last year’s semi matchup this time: Federer v. Murray, and Djokovic v. Nadal.

    Unless Tsonga gets Nadal in the first match (and that doesn’t appear to be the case), he won’t win. Nadal will get stronger with each encounter, until by the semis he’s once again Super Nadal.

    Only Federer and Djokovic (assuming he’s at full strength) will have a chance against Nadal then.

    Last year was similar: early loss in Shanghai, skipped Paris with shoulder injury, started out shaky in London but became nigh-unbeatable by the semis and final. Only the genius of Federer stopped him.

    I predict the same sort of thing will happen this year.

    Hopefully Federer can beat Nadal in the round-robin phase; they’ve never played at that stage before and Federer may not feel quite the level of urgency he would in the semis or final, especially if he’s already qualified for the knockout stage. But I think he’s very motivated to win this year, and he’s playing very well, so he has a good chance.

    Go Roger!

    [Reply]

    Duarte Reply:

    “… Federer may not feel quite the level of urgency he would in the semis or final, especially if he’s already qualified for the knockout stage.”

    I think the second match of the RR stage will be between the winners of the 1st match and the losers of the 1st match.

    So should Roger beat Tsonga and nadal beat Fish, Roger and nadal should play in the 2nd match.

    [Reply]

    Ru-an Reply:

    Good points Steve. Nadal got lucky though and draw Fish first. If it was Roger or Tsonga he would have struggled. I’ll be surprised if this year he plays like last year though. He came off three straight slams last year. This year he Djokovic owned him and the losses in Tokyo and Shanghai could have been a result of that. I don’t think he is on the same level of confidence as last year. He may just not make semis or lose in the semis this year.

    [Reply]

    booya719 Reply:

    As far as I can recall they always play based on ranking once the pools are made. Highest ranked plays lowest ranked first off the bat. Nadal gets the benefit of playing Fish first due to his higher ranking.

    (4) Federer vs (6) Tsonga
    (2) Nadal vs (8) Fish

    Then

    (2) Nadal vs (6) Tsonga
    (4) Federer vs (8) Fish

    Then

    (2) Nadal vs (4) Federer
    (6) Tsonga vs (8) (Fish)

    Both Nadal and Federer could be 2-0 going into the final round robin match and then it won’t matter who wins or loses it (except for getting more ranking points with a win). But if one player is 1-1, then the 2-0 guy has the chance to eliminate the other guy. If Nadal ends up being 1-1 then Federer could eliminate Nadal right away in the round robin if Federer is 2-0. And vice versa, if Federer is 1-1 and Nadal is 2-0, then Federer MUST beat Nadal in straight sets to stay in the tournament.

    Winning their first two matches will guarantee both Nadal and Federer to make the semis, but one loss for either man before their match makes it a lot more interesting.

    [Reply]

    michael Reply:

    booya719, I think it is almost like that.

    First day:
    (4) Federer vs (6) Tsonga
    (2) Nadal vs (8) Fish

    Then it is the winner of match 1 against the winner of match 2.

    After that you usually have the situation where at least 3 players are able to make the semis after the second round. At least there is a direct battle for a place in the semis by two players.

    Suppose Roger beats Tsonga and Fish beats Nadal. Then Roger plays Fish and Tsonga Nadal in the second round. If Roger and Tsonga win you have the direct battle between Tsonga and Fish for a place in the semis. Of course Roger will beat Nadal for a clean first place :-)

    [Reply]

    booya719 Reply:

    Thanks for clarifying. I wasn’t sure of how they decided who plays the 2nd match. It does make sense to have the winner play the winner so that the final match will always have some meaning. I never really thought before about how much the first matches are really key.

    I see both Federer and Nadal going 1-0 and then meeting in the 2nd round in this case. It would be nice to see them play the final round robin match though, if Nadal does somehow find a way to lose to Fish.

    [Reply]

  8. Thought folks would like to see these comments by Fish:

    Fish will taste the unique atmosphere at the O2 for the first time on Sunday night when he steps out in front of 17,000 fans to face last year’s runner-up Nadal. It’s a match-up in which the American feels he can fare well.

    “I feel like I match up better against Rafa than I do against Novak. I beat Rafa in Cincinnati for the first time and actually played him pretty good in Tokyo as well,” said Fish, who snapped a six-match losing streak against the Spaniard when he beat him in the quarter-finals of the Western & Southern Open.

    Considering his other match-ups in Group B, the right-hander commented, “Roger can blow anybody off the court anytime he wants and he’s easily playing the best of anyone right now. I’m obviously looking forward to playing Jo again; we’ve only played that one time at the US Open [fourth round], a really good five-set match, so I look forward to getting back on the court. I love playing against him; I love his style of play. We both like to attack and serve big and come up to the net quite a lot, so it should be fun.”

    [Reply]

    booya719 Reply:

    I like Fish’s positivity but in all reality I don’t like his chances against Nadal here. Nadal wants to win this. He intentionally skipped Paris to save his energy. We all know Nadal does not care about winning in Cincinnati and saves his energy for the US Open. Remember when Nadal tanked the Baghdatis match last year to intentionally avoid playing Roger in the semis so that Roger would not have any chance to gain experience playing him on that surface before the US Open.

    But with these pools Nadal cannot avoid Roger. But I have an interesting question. If both men are 2-0 and have the SFs already locked up before their match, what would happen if Nadal intentionally retires from the Federer match to avoid playing him and save energy for his semi? Would he still be allowed to play in the semis or would a retirement from that match knock him out of the tournament? Just an interesting thought because it’s a round robin – not bracket elimination.

    [Reply]

  9. Dave, I had the same question as you regarding Federer losing points instead of gaining them after his Paris win. Thanks to Jack, who was kind enough to answer me, it’s because for some reason (which is still unfathomable to me), they take away everyone’s earned London points from last year, before this tournament begins. So since Federer won last year, he had the most points to lose (1500). I double-checked the rankings to see if Jack’s answer fits, and sure enough, it does. Nadal also lost a lot of points since he was in the final last year, while Murray and the Djoker lost the least since they didn’t make it that far. In any case, the bottom line is that if Roger wins this tournament, he’ll get those 1500 pts. back again, which should vault him up to #3 past Murray in the year-end rankings. Why the ATP goes through all these contortions on ranking points is beyond me. Why don’t they just leave the points there for each player until after London, like they do for most other tournaments?

    [Reply]

    Ru-an Reply:

    Yeah this is what i said in my post. And yeah, i don’t get it either. Seems dumb.

    [Reply]

    Jiten Reply:

    Well, Roger will get back all his 1500 points only if he wins the tournament without losing a match. The break up of points is as follows: RR 200, SF 400 and F 500. I strongly believe, Roger can still do it.

    GO ROGER GO!

    [Reply]

  10. Taking up the remarks of Dave and Balthazar, in the WTA singles ranking system it is standard – the whole year through – to determine the rankings by taking away one’s points earned in the previous year before the tournament starts.
    Whatever underlying system one decides to apply, having consistency in the way you apply it and not change it in the end or in the course of the calendar year, is more important than the choice of ranking system in itself.

    [Reply]

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *